Community Studio Build - Help Needed

[New Wave Studios]

Hi,

I have been lurking on this forum for a while now but not really had any reason to post until now, lots of great advice here but difficult to get an idea of what I need to do exactly.

We are building a community studio where we will be teaching kids to keep them off the streets and working on our own production.

We have a small grant to work with and a commecial space has be rented, we take over the keys in 4 weeks so I would like to get planning now

The space is 16 x 16 ft and all we need is a control room.

Ceilings are 15 ft high

We have about $4000 to spend but we are being helped by local builders and carpenters so the costs will be drastically reduced, basically we want something that looks very nice and soundproofed so that offices next door can work.

Floor - Concrete and walls but we are looking for a room in a room I think from what I can gather.

I just would like to know how you guys would get the best out of the room (may post this in the design section? )

The door can be anywhere as on of the walls is studded and we can cut it in no problem.

Questions:

We want a floating floor as there are units below, something simple but whats the best way to go about this.

Can we have the ceiling at 7.5ft is that enough? as we want to get storage above it.

Thanks, any more info you need please ask

[rod gervais]

The space is 16 x 16 ft and all we need is a control room.

Ceilings are 15 ft high

Damn near a cube - but enough room to get a control room and some storage -

Floor - Concrete and walls but we are looking for a room in a room I think from what I can gather.

Yes you are - seeing as you mention you need isolation -

We want a floating floor as there are units below, something simple but whats the best way to go about this.

Ching-ching........... things just got expensive.

In order for the floor to be of any value you need to get the decks center frequency down around 10Hz........ that means concrete - and that translates to weight on the existing deck and money - in that order of importance.

Everything begins with your hiring a structural engineer to determine exactly how much load you can carry..............

Can we have the ceiling at 7.5ft is that enough? as we want to get storage above it.

I don't see this happening - minimum headroom for most building codes is 7'-0" - and 7'-6" in the life safety codes.

With a 7'6" ceiling in the main room - even a 7' ceiling in the room above would only give you 6" of structure for the ceiling itself - and 2x6" joist will not get the job done.

The building official will consider this a commercial venture - and as such the storage loading is (depending on where you're located) anywhere between 50 to 100psf of live load.

That would put you (at the very least with 50psf loading) into a 2 x 12 - which would give you a ceiling heigh above of 6'6" - no where near the code requirements. [/quote]

Anyway - everything begins with your hiring a structural engineer to tell you exactly how much weight you can put on your deck - that will determine the max you can construct.

I have to be honest with you - even with donated labor - if you float a slab and thus the entire room - you would be very VERY lucky to do this with your budget.

Sincerely,

Rod

Better you don't build a square control room - and do as I mention above - storage on the control room level -

This will give you more volume in the control room - which will help acoustically.

[New Wave Studios]

Thanks Rod,

Yea it does sound like this might be difficult to sort out.

What I dont understand tho is about the floor..

Surely if its already concrete and we run some timber over it resting on the neophene (??) pads and pack it down with Rockwool/sand covered by sheets of ply/plasterboard with thickunderlay and carpet surely thats going to help?

It doesnt have to be that well sound proofed since its commericial space and we are allow to make noise as its B1 usage, also there are no houses near, all we want to do is diffuse it a little really as no live recording is taking place there its more to make beats etc and teaching.

Thanks again

I hear you about the ceiling, what about a half ceiling so at least we have a little area above 8 x 16 or something??

Thanks again

[rod gervais]

Thanks Rod,

Yea it does sound like this might be difficult to sort out.

What I dont understand tho is about the floor..

Surely if its already concrete and we run some timber over it resting on the neophene (??) pads and pack it down with Rockwool/sand covered by sheets of ply/plasterboard with thickunderlay and carpet surely thats going to help?

Not necessarily, in fact it could actually hurt.

What you're describing is a pretty good deal for impact noise - so great for a bowling alley - a dance floor - etc., but not for the LF that comes with bands.

This from Mason Industries - one of the leaders in the sound isolation product industries:

“It is often necessary to provide a wooden floating floor rather than the heavier concrete construction with wood topping. Cost or weight restrictions may be the factor. In older buildings it is often necessary to improve on existing floors with a lightweight impact noise resistant construction. A resiliently supported wooden floor will reduce the rumbling noise of a bowling ball, the click, click of a woman’s heels and that portion of a typical noise generated by a piano that travels down the piano legs and into the structure. It will offer only minor reduction of airborne sound, as there is insufficient mass in the surface. In some applications on stages or in rehearsal rooms the primary purpose is relief and comfort for the dancers. Landing on concrete or hard mounted wood surfaces is very damaging to a dancer’s feet and legs.”

Now - to clarify - when I say it could hurt.

An assembly can actually magnify sounds, that are in the process of passing through a system, at or around their center frequency.

Thus building the wrong system can be worse than building nothing at all.

I might consider doing a sand filled - but then again we are back to the weight issue.

One other thing - once you have plans it is critical (I cannot stress this enough) that you have this approved by a structural engineer before constructing - in fact - if your building official has any brains at all - he will insist on it.

When everything is said and done - even without a concrete or sand filled deck - you are adding a lot of weight to the existing deck here - and should not leave anything to chance.

One thing about deck failures - they are catastrophic in nature - there will be no indication of anything wrong - and then in the next second it's all over.

You would be absolutely amazed at the number of people who have told me (on this and opther forums) that there was no problem - they knew for a fact that the deck could support their loads - that have come back and thanked me for insisting on this - because their engineer told them "no way - no shape - no manner".

I hear you about the ceiling, what about a half ceiling so at least we have a little area above 8 x 16 or something??

I suppose you could talk to your official - but the what the codes proscribe don't leave a lot of room for conversation.

Rod

[New Wave Studios]

Thanks again Rod, does it matter that we wont be recording any bands and simply mixing and making tunes on the computer? we will only be sampling and using keyboards no bands will be involved.

What about some acoustic floor panelw with underlay and carpet ontop that will be ok then?

Does that kind of thing apply to us regarding the ceiling as we are in the UK?

Thanks mate will have some photos later

Cheers

Mike

[sharward]

. . . as we are in the UK? . . .

Mike, this is the first that we learned of your location.

Please update your profile to include your location. That is second item covered in the "Before You Post" announcement. All of the items called for in that announcement are critical.

--Keith

[New Wave Studios]

. . . as we are in the UK? . . .

Mike, this is the first that we learned of your location.

Please update your profile to include your location. That is second item covered in the "Before You Post" announcement. All of the items called for in that announcement are critical.

--Keith

Done

[New Wave Studios]

Any help?

[AVare]

Any help?

What furher direction do you have questions on? Rod seems to have answered everything, from what I can read. Ask away!

Andre