John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum Archive

hi everybody, i'm new here - thanks a lot for this great resource of profound knowledge. i'm glad i found it

soon i want to buy a decent pair of monitors, my favourites are:
ADAM P-22A, Mackie HR824 or the new Events.
now i can get a pair of JBL - LSR 28 P for about 1100 $ which i know nothing about.!?
what do you think of all of them? which one are good for soffit mounting?

thanks for your time in advance.
greetings
D

nobody out there? barefoot, any advice would be really appreciated.

another question:

does it really make sense to soffit mount nearfields? if yes, what if upgrading later to "bigger toys"?
i also mean in relation to room dimensions, desk's position and the nears on speaker stands or the bridge?

thanks
D

You might want to relax a bit, both barefoot and I are at Pacific time in USA - he probably won't even SEE this for a couple more hours yet, if then. He's been pretty busy lately, between his day job and rolling out his new speaker line.

There are ways of doing what you ask, partially dependent on the size of the room and volume levels required at mix position, etc - I'll let Thomas cover that - there's a very good reason why he's the moderator here.

It's now 4 PM here, if you're still up I'd get some sleep and check when you wake up... Steve

I won't claim any profound knowledge, but that JBL and the Haflers are probably my favorite speakers in the price range.

the dreamer wrote:hi everybody, i'm new here - thanks a lot for this great resource of profound knowledge. i'm glad i found it

soon i want to buy a decent pair of monitors, my favourites are:
ADAM P-22A, Mackie HR824 or the new Events.
now i can get a pair of JBL - LSR 28 P for about 1100 $ which i know nothing about.!?
what do you think of all of them? which one are good for soffit mounting?

thanks for your time in advance.
greetings
D

steve, jon, thanks a lot for the replys.

ohh,sorry, i forgot that you guys are on the other side of the planet - looking forward to "meet thomas within his timezone!"

Hi!

I do have a pair of those JBL-LSR 28 P.

I love them, good dispersion, seamless woofer/tweeter transition. The bass is quite efficient/deep for a box of that size.

Maybe peoples would say that they don't like "JBL sound" and prefer Dyna's or Adams or Genelec's but they are not in the same price range.

They replaced my old and trusty JBL4401/Yamaha sub. But with theese new JBL's, they go deeper and cleaner AND louder. I like to know what is happening when I mix post prod, so I'm more aware on what's going on in the bass region. Shure, a sub would be nice too but when I look at the size of my small control room, they could bring more problems than solve.

Anyway this is a personnal choice and taste. The more you know the weak/strongs points, the best your mixes will be.

Hope it helps

I've never heard the JBLs, so I can't comment on their performance.

I would say the best monitors for soffit mounting are the ones with front ports. I've come to the conclusion that soffit mounting rear ported speakers creates too many problems and uncertainties in the low frequency performance.

Also, to get the proper low frequency balance when soffit mounting a speaker that was designed to be free standing, you need a low shelf filter. I cover this issue in this tread. http://johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=766

Thomas

True! Oops, I frogot the original thread, I've just answered about this model. They are back proted so... no luck for soffit

They are powered monitors, so cooling them is a problem.

thomas, serge, thanx for the replys!

thomas, if your time allows, could you please address my second question from above?

and in some other thread you said:
"Ports and passive radiators need to be unobstructed and free to radiate into the room. Soffit mounting a rear ported or passive radiator speaker is still possible, but very tricky. The only real purpose of soffit mounting is to enlarge the size of the front speaker baffle. Therefore, a rigid "floating" panel with an open back could work just as well as mounting the speaker into the wall. If the panel height and width are large compared to the panel's distance from the wall, then the sound waves will simply see the panel as an extension of the wall. The difficulty with a rear ported speaker, however, is that the panel dimensions must not be so large such that the path length from the rear of the speaker to the front causes phase cancellations in the frequency range where the port and the woofer are working together (i.e. the octave above the tuning frequency). "

what do you mean by the floating panel? is it hanging or a "soffit mounted" panel in the wall where normally the speakers are - surrounded by neoprene?

thank you in advance

He's talking about ,basically, a big front plate flush with the face of the speakers, with the whole thing hanging free in the room. It'd increase your bottom end response some.

There's another good point in there, though- if a rear ported speaker is designed well, the designers figured the time it takes the port sound to wrap around the front and meet up with the direct sound. You're messing with that relationship by making the path longer.

i'd just soffit something sealed, or something with a front port. The bigger JBL LSR32's have always struck me as a good candidate, provided you give them a shitload of clean power.

thanks jon, that makes sense.

Jon Best wrote:i'd just soffit something sealed, or something with a front port. The bigger JBL LSR32's have always struck me as a good candidate, provided you give them a shitload of clean power.

This would be a good candidate for soffit mount.

And a Crown Studio Reference I amp should be enough!

Yeah, I managed the recording department of a Mars when the LSR's came out, and I was astounded at the difference the amp made with these speakers- like an order of magnitude more than other speakers I'd had the opportunity to work with. They had a bottom-line Crown in there, and the speakers just sounded awful. We went up through a twice as big Mackie, a 600W Crest, and when we got to a Crown K2 (~900W a side), the things just started to wake up.

We didn't really have a big, good, clean studio amp around, but I'd imagine the Reference would do the trick. Or that big ass new Bryston, as the LSR's aren't overly bright.

serge instrumental wrote:

Jon Best wrote:i'd just soffit something sealed, or something with a front port. The bigger JBL LSR32's have always struck me as a good candidate, provided you give them a shitload of clean power.

This would be a good candidate for soffit mount.

And a Crown Studio Reference I amp should be enough!

I own a pair of the LSR28P as well as the LSR12P sub (which I just bought the sub about 7 months ago).

These monitors are awesome sounding at all levels. If you can buy a pair at $1100 (as you mentioned) that's a great deal. That's below dealer cost ( I know, we're a dealer where I work).

And if you add a sub, they really sound great. I'm in the process of designing a studio (you can see the plans on my post in the design forum).

When I first heard these, I was blown away by what I heard. I was very skeptical at first, and after listening to about 8 or 9 other pairs of monitors, these are what I went for a couple years ago when they first came out. They do have a newer model out (6300 series). I not sure of the difference. Haven't spoke w/ my rep about them yet.

I do plan on soffit mounting mine. I haven't fully designed the framing yet for the soffits. I designing to use them in a 5.1 configuration. Which means I still need to buy 3 more.

Does anyone here have idea's on soffit mounting these? I noticed on Johns studio page, that Sjoko's studio did this.

Aaron

Aaron,

You should read this post regarding the likely results of Sjoko's setup. http://johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=468 That would certainly be a best case scenario and assumes that he doesn't have a dual chambered port effect happening. I mention an open back soffit option in that post, but I really think this is a method of last resort. It just presents too many problems. However, I've recently developed an electronic method for soffit mounting rear-ported speakers that solves all of these issues. I'm keeping it proprietary at this point, until I figure out the best way to implement it as a stand-alone product. But if you or anyone else is interested, send me a PM.

Thomas