The 2 Camps of Preamps

[mark4man]

People...

I recently acquired a Grace Design 101 mic/inst. pre for my project studio. Sounds beautiful. A few months ago, I acquired a Korg D1600mkII digital multitracker for location recording. Sounds beautiful.

Now...I know enough about classes of operation & component quality to be able to understand that the Grace is heads & heels above the Korg in performance (& I'm sure when I get around to an a/b test I'll hear the difference)...but I wonder...

...There's lots of little project studios around that record local artists, using for example, Mackie mixers, w/ their onboard XDR pre’s. Those guys swear by their boards...wouldn't have anything else. There's also lots of little project studios around that have racks of external pre's...RNP's & Focusrite's & dbx's & Great River's & Langevin's & MindPrint's, etc. Those guys swear by their gear, also.

Today I read a review on a $200 pro audio level 1/2 rack stereo pre...& it says it's super quiet & faithfully reproduces signal with quality & headroom that would rival any studio console.

What's goin' on? Who's right? Is everybody right? Has the quality of even cheaply produced components reached a point where good signal amplification is less than a hundred bucks per channel (& doesn't sound that much different from units at $500 a channel?) Forget the differences between tube & xformer & solid-state; & the coloration of the sound produced...I'm talking about; it seems like they can take a preamp design from a quality mixer (which is crammed side-by-side w/ 15 other identical pre's), put two of them in an external box & have a boutique product with a high price tag.

So...what's the difference? Does Class-A operation sound only marginally better than Class-A mode? Are the op-amp based pre's in a pro audio level board only a teeny, tiny bit more spurious than the self-biasing, fully differential, DC servoed, transimpedance instrumentation amps in a free-standing boutique model?

Can the indie artist walking into the studio off the street hear the difference? Can the mastering engineer?

[I know this a philosophical type rant...but I'm interested in hearing opinions on the state of the art from other members.]

Thanks,

mark4man

[cfegela]

I play and produce rock through a mackie board I love...I know what I'm getting and it sounds good everytime. My friends bought a behringer and it is the worst pice of crap I have ever heard.

I had a MOTU interface that was too finicky to keep, but the A/D converters were really much more 'spacious' than my current echo converter. I can't have computer problems mid-session.

I have an RNP + RNC for solos and vox and it is really unbelieveable. I have never heard anything so thick and upfront. I'm sure the best preamp with the best mic with the best singer in the best room will sound better, but not for $500. In the same range the presonus and joemeek stuff just isn't the same sound quality

I have heard some magical gear on occasion...in particular the dbx160, drawmer 1960, and some neve preamps, stuff that really does what you imagine it does: put in any signal, and out comes a huge, fat, silky, perfect sound. But you never know when you are looking at classic stuff.

Basically what I'm trying to say is at any price point, there are some unbelievable bargains and some incredible rip-offs. It comes down to using your ears to find equipment you like the sound of (and can take a full days work if you are doing commercial work) and fits in your budget.

Don't get too caught up in the never ending search for the magic gear or magic room. What's important? Write good songs, record clean and loud, and HAVE FUN!

[mark4man]

cfegela...

Thanks, man. All good info & very insightful. Will keep everything you said in mind.

mark4man


BTW - Can the dbx160 still be had? (i.e., is that a current peice or a classic)?

Thanks again.

[John Sayers]

The DBX160 is a classic compressor.

great on guitars, pretty severe compression BTW

cheers
john

[giles117]

Now if they would only Model it

Love to see that on a UAD-1 Card

I should add, I love it on Kick Drum

[Alec]

I wondered the same thing as well......until I got the 3daudio Pre CD,
http://www.3daudioinc.com/3daudio_prelp.html
and blindly listened and compared 34 Pre amps in my own studio on my own monitors, all because of Lynn Fuston's project.

I believe even though you think they sound the same, or similar, I bet if you used the grace on every track of a 16track song, and then took a mackie xdr"pro" and did the same, and then compared, you Would Hear a difference. Now wherther one is better than the other that is up to your own taste.

I can say this, just recently I took a 57 mic plugged it straight into my Mackie XDR "PRO" pre amp , no compression, flat and sang through it listening in my monitors, and then took the 57 and put it thru my UA 610, no compression, flat no eq, and could totally hear the difference...

Do you use the grace just for 1 track? I bet you would hear the difference if you took a condensor mic and used it as an overhead for drums, and a/b with the korg

[tmix]

What Alec said is my experiance.

If you areonly uingthe mic preamp on 1 or 2 tracks, and the balance of your music is loops or samples, youprobablywont notice a huge difference of a good preamp and a great one. But when you mic everything or run synths thrugh th pres, and you pile 20 to 30 tracks on top everything, that is when you will notice a severe difference in clarity, depth and dimensionality.

At least I did.

Tom